Three Nashville-based physician brothers dressed in midnight blue evening clothes were honored at Atlanta's Trumpet awards at the end of January. Two of them are long-time clients of New York tailor Leonard Logsdail and one of them is wearing ready to wear. Which is it, and why do you think so?
Photo: Kore Magazine
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44 comments:
The gentleman on the left. He has pocket flaps whereas his other brothers do not.
The gentleman in the middle is not showing any cuff, so my guess would be him.
They all look great, but I'm guessing the guy in the middle is RTW. He has some minor issues at the sleevehead, though it could a deceiving photo. He also has less of a lapel roll than the other two.
I would guess the one in the center, since the sleevehead and pitch seem a bit off and there’s no shirt cuff showing.
Obviously all three gentlemen are admirable individuals and completely on-point on the red carpet.
From the position of a young man still learning the gist of tailoring I think this is a pretty great learning opportunity:
If I had to choose I would say the man in the center. I can't see his shirt cuff and the sleeve looks a little sloppy at the shoulder and a little too wide in the upper-arm, but just so. I wouldn't have noticed if he weren't standing in the same pose as two other men in similar dress-- but honestly it's hard too say? I feel if I met each of these men individually I would be hard-pressed to notice any imperfection.
I'll venture a guess and say the one in the middle is wearing ready to wear. First off, he looks the most stiff. Secondly, his bow tie looks pre-tied. I can't imagine anyone wearing a tailor made tuxedo and no knowing how to tie a bow tie.
Hello Will,
These three gentlemen are obviously elegant. But the first of them, left, wears a dinner jacket with flap pockets... And I am certainly psychorigid, but I don't like very much colored pocket square with black tie. The two other dinner suits (center and right) seem to be perfectly taylored.
(Sorry for my poor english. I'm trying to improve it ! :) )
The gentlemen on the left. The flap pockets and the form of the lapel irritate me so I take this as a sign...
There is something about the button placement on the double breasted that seem too low for bespoke.
I noticed the same issues with the sleeve construction on the gentleman in the center as prior contributors have noted. He's my guess.
(That said, all three of these guys look great -- and better than 99% of the people one sees donning formal wear.)
I'll wager my bet that the ready to wear is the one on the left for the following reasons:
1. Fabric quality of the left suit looks cheaper, lower quiality.
2. Standard cut (peak lapel/SB)versus the shawl lapel and DB dinner suits.
3. It looks as though there is no grosgrain on the lapel of the left suit, as opposed to the middle and right lapels.
3. While not a factor of the suit itself, the middle and right men are both wearing a boutonniere. I would expect this from men wearing tailored clothing while not being as likely for a man buying RTW.
I agree that it's the one on the far left: as stated, the pocket flaps are wrong and the lapel and collar are skimped.
I am voting for the gentleman in the middle. The roll of his lapel and the issue at the sleevehead are my reasons.
All three look very nice.
At first I saw the lack of shirt sleeve on the man in the middle, but that could be his posture. Peak lapels with pocket flaps says that's off the rack; I have seen pocket flaps on a lot of RTW these days. The gentleman on the left is my pick.
The buttonholes would suggest the one on the left. They all look good though.
I will be the first to say the man on the gentleman on the far right. My main reason is that there is no "give" at the waist. when you button a jacket, there should be some tension on the buttons, not lots, but some. This is visible on both the brother at center and at left The jacket also seems a touch long. Is this a contest? Is this one of the post that brings with it one of the famous ASW prizes?
my vote is the guy with flaps
I'm guessing the one on our left- he has pocket flaps and does not have a carnation in his lapel- this might mean the lack of a real lapel hole which is less and less common on RTW.
However if I just went on fit I'd say the guy in the middle. No cuff showing, some issues with the sleeve, and I feel like the collar doesn't fit quite flush against his neck.. however, all of those could be caused by some awkwardness in his stance or something caught on his companion's dress or something like that. Hard to say, they all look pretty good. RTW or not.
This is a good game. I agree with all the previous comments about the man in the centre, and would add that there seems to be a bit of a gap between jacket and shirt collar. But looking at the cloth of this suit and the man to the right they seem the same shade of midnight blue, with similar tailoring around the pockets and darts. That would suggest that the centre suit is simply not too well finished. That leaves the guy on the left as the off the peg man. Aside from the less interesting colour of fabric and the pocket flaps, the cuff buttons seem a bit on the messy side. When do we get the answer?
They all look good, but the physician in the middle I think is in RTW:
-there is a slight pull at the button, which is also perhaps and inch or two too high
-the drape of the sleeve is slightly off, and the sleeve length is a bit too long
-the collar sits slightly too low, exposing more shirt collar
-the roll through the chest is not quite what it could be
-maybe its just a combination of little things, but I don't get that overall beauty of the suit that comes from bespoke from the middle.
Far left - pocket flaps on the tux.
I agree with the guesses that point to the guy on the left mostly because of the flap pockets. The fact that he is wearing peak lapels would give him the most formal style ut of the three (hardly a standard feature on a RTW DJ as someone pointed out). There are other signs that lead us to guess that the other two may well be RTW as well, but the reality is we're all just guessing without a better picture and angle of view.
Middle one, for the reasons J outlined (I also am a young guy) - upper arm is too big and dimpled.
Though all three look better than anything worn at the Oscars last weekend (except possibly by Jeremy Renner).
Oo! I love this question.
I'll guess the gentlemen in the middle has a ready-made suit because the sleeve seems to have extra material which is bunching a little [compared with the exact fit of the sleeves of the other two] and the top button is pulling at the fabric.
Middle. He should be wearing a turndown collar with the shawl lapels (and possibly a four-in-hand, depending), and there's no cuff showing. His coat sleeve looks off as well, but that might be remedied by a bit of judiciously applied steam. The carnations are a good touch.
It's a tough call though- they're all well-enough dressed with little things here and there that one would fix to make it more appropriate...
Far left is RTW, largely because the centre and right appear to have some similar elements so it would make sense both to me made by the same house/person.
However, the more fundamental point is that it's so hard to tell, esp. from a still photograph and from the front.
I would say the gentleman on the left. The flap pockets could just be a stylistic choice. However, in additional to the points mentioned by the others, the shape of the breast pocket is different from the centre and right jackets.
A difficult one, indeed.
Let's try this: None of them is obviously RTW in that it fits really badly, or exhibits any severe aberrations such as a satin notch lapel. Minor fit issues should never be taken for face value in still photographs - eg, the apparently "wrong" sleeve length in the middle suit may be caused by the bracelet holding back the shirt cuff. As a matter of fact, the sleeve on the middle suit, if anything, appears to be cut shorter than the one on the left suit.
So, let's focus on features that are not easy to come by in RTW, even though that might also be misleading as, increasingly, upmarket brands try to emulate Savile Row style:
The right one is a double-breasted with a 4 on 2 configuration, and apparently in midnight blue, featuring a lapel buttonhole big enough to take a real flower - bespoke, I'd say.
The middle one appears to be single-breasted one button with a rather nicely shaped shawl lapel and, comparing the colour to the left suit, may also be in midnight blue and has the same sizeable lapel buttonhole (or so it seems) - another bespoke.
That leaves me with the left suit being RTW ...pretty decent fit, well done.
dE
My guess is the man on the left. The torso of the coat doesn't look to be fully canvased.
I will have to go with the double breasted gentleman. Initially, I was thinking the middle man, but something just bothered me about the DB. It just seems to hang a bit too loosely. Also, the two SB guys seem relatively close in age, twins maybe, so it might stand that pick the same tailor whereas the older looking DB man doesn't have one, at least for the tux.
Got to be the one on the left. Pocket flaps and peaked lapels. I also have to disagree with Will; I think the DJ on the left is black,while the other two are blue. I have never seen a RTW DJ in blue.
The man on the far left. The flap pockets and the lapels. It is very well done for RTW, however. My belief lies with the fact that nowadays, the major RTW companies have been blurring the lines on tuxedos because it is cheaper to make a "Tuxedo" by using black fabric and fake grosgrain using the same pattern as you would for a suit than having a separate pattern. Further, while I have seen well made peaked lapel tuxedos RTW, I have never seen one in double breasted (not to mention, that double breasteds rarely fit so well of the rack) RTW, nor have I seen one RTW with shawl collar. In fact, I have a black odd jacket that looks incredibly similar to that of the man on the edge, except mine has a buttonhole and jetted pockets.
The guy in the middle. That's an awful collar and pre-tie.
The one on the left because of the flaps. The gentleman in the middle probably does not stand naturally, otherwise we would not see the issues with sleeve, sleevehead...
Regards,le.gentleman
I'm saying the one in the middle is RTW: sleeve head (ruins the drape of the sleeve), cuff, and collar.
The one on the left could be RTW, and tailored well. The canvas looks like it could be fused.
If we could see the pant I think we would be able to tell more from the proportions.
What a great post! It must be the man in the middle. The jackets on the other two look like they were poured over their shoulders--just lovely. The jacket in the middle is a bit boxy and awkward by contrast. Still, they all look fantastic, as do their partners.
Not knowing as much as your other commentators, I am going with the middle brother because of the tie!
I've had suits right off the rack that fit perfectly, and I've had more than a few ill-fitting and terrible bespoke suits. (Of course my tailor is not as esteemed as these esteemed gentlemen.)
And yet there hangs in my closet a forty-year old cashmere sports coat that belonged to my grandfather, with leather buttons and silk paisley lining, a hand-made item by a magnificent artist whose tailor's tape never touched my person, but whose creation fits me like a glove. All these gentlemen look splendid, so why make a subtle and unbelievably snobby distinction between bespoke and off-the-rack when none is required.
I've got pocket flaps on my bespoke Carr Son and Woor DJ. It's just a personal thing so I do not take that as a pointer.
The man on the right, I think, is wearing OTR. His collar seems too large for his jacket and there doesn't appear to be much tuck at the waist (though it's hard to tell from the angle).
I have to say its the man on the right as well. While I think the man in the center's jacket could be half an inch longer and that sleeve is wrinkled a bit I just dont see how a professional tailor would let you out the door with pocket flaps.
Sean said:
"Further, while I have seen well made peaked lapel tuxedos RTW, I have never seen one in double breasted (not to mention, that double breasteds rarely fit so well of the rack) RTW, nor have I seen one RTW with shawl collar."
JAB makes both and I have a Zegna DB 6 x2 in my closet right now.
We know that the gentleman on the right woulod never wear RTW. No need to look further. The lapel, body, and shoulder on the gentleman to the left lay properly and roll properly and fit properly. So we direct our attention to the gentleman in the center. I suspect the lapel roll is fine, it's just the handkercheif that is bumping it a bit. There's a bit of pull on the button, the body doesn't lay as cleanly, the shape of the shoulder is less tidy, and the sleeves are a bit long.
Good game. Nice to have one's senses sharpened.
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